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Brepea
post Sep 19 2017, 07:30 AM
Post#1



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


I have just finished an application for a client - super fast on my local pc; a big HOWEVER...demo to client was fine (when using one computer on their network). When another user logged in the system was extremely slow and non-usable. For e.g. there is a main search form which at most has <100 rows (so extremely small dataset) - this form displays one line from row one, then adds the 2nd - through to the 80th - it displays one row at a time and flashes then disappears and comes back again. While this happens you can't do anything.

The application is regular Access Setup (split FE and BE). BE resides in a network folder. I have added each user to the folder's BE and FEUpdater folders with full write permissions. It's no more than 10MB.
It's amazingly fast on local pc - and it's just unusable on this network when more than 1 user logs in.

I must say though we were in a conference room style room and using wifi (what's that WAN i guess?) - is this the potential issue? All the while i've been developing the application i've only ever used WAN (so not plugged in the Ethernet cable) and it's been no different in speed.

I'm stumped - and i know i have not given you much detail - but from your experience could you help me troubleshoot this somehow?

Thanks
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DanielPineault
post Sep 19 2017, 07:35 AM
Post#2


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There are numerous factors that can all impact this.

Network (I would never use a bound Access database over WiFi)
Server - Hard drive, RAM, CPU
FE - Each user has their own personal copy of the FE? Location of the FEs is also crucial. In some companies, directories such as Documents are actually mapped from a server and not actually local, so it becomes important to validate that the FE directory is truly 100% local.
Any improvement deploying an accde version?

One question though, do you establish a persistent connection between the FE and the BE at the startup of your database? If not, this would be the first thing I'd be looking to implement!

--------------------
Daniel Pineault (2010-2017 Microsoft MVP)
Professional Help: http://www.cardaconsultants.com
Free MS Access Code, Tips, Tricks and Samples: http://www.devhut.net

* Design should never say "Look at me". It should always say "Look at this". -- David Craib
* A user interface is like a joke, if you have to explain it, it's not that good! -- Martin LeBlanc


All code samples, demonstration databases, links,... are provided 'AS IS' and are to be used at your own risk! Take the necessary steps to check, validate ...
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Brepea
post Sep 19 2017, 07:44 AM
Post#3



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


Hi Daniel

Yes - all the recommended approaches i've followed (with exception of trying to demo the application with WAN [it just never occurred to me at the time])...

So: FE: C:\Databases\Application & BE on Network Folder S:\\

I'm thinking it must have the WAN - i was just so stumped at how poor it behaved i didn't even think about the WAN until writing this topic...but could the WAN make the application so poorly? I guess i need to test this - but really wanted to run this past this forum.

I am using Tony Toews's AutoFEUpdater to handle the distribution...
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GroverParkGeorge
post Sep 19 2017, 07:51 AM
Post#4


UA Admin
Posts: 31,197
Joined: 20-June 02
From: Newcastle, WA


Here's an oldie but goodie on using Access over a WAN. Still one of the best resources available.

And please pay heed to Daniel's comment about WIFI. It is not a good idea to run bound Access forms over WiFi. I suppose WiFi performance has improved over the years, but it's still not stable enough to support a serious Access application.

--------------------
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DanielPineault
post Sep 19 2017, 08:14 AM
Post#5


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Posts: 5,451
Joined: 30-June 11



QUOTE
I'm thinking it must have the WAN - i was just so stumped at how poor it behaved i didn't even think about the WAN until writing this topic...but could the WAN make the application so poorly? I guess i need to test this - but really wanted to run this past this forum.


See: http://www.devhut.net/2016/09/24/access-ba...edrive-dropbox/

--------------------
Daniel Pineault (2010-2017 Microsoft MVP)
Professional Help: http://www.cardaconsultants.com
Free MS Access Code, Tips, Tricks and Samples: http://www.devhut.net

* Design should never say "Look at me". It should always say "Look at this". -- David Craib
* A user interface is like a joke, if you have to explain it, it's not that good! -- Martin LeBlanc


All code samples, demonstration databases, links,... are provided 'AS IS' and are to be used at your own risk! Take the necessary steps to check, validate ...
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Brepea
post Sep 19 2017, 08:41 AM
Post#6



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


I have now tested it with the LAN plugged in and it's exactly the same...i'm stumped...!
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GroverParkGeorge
post Sep 19 2017, 09:23 AM
Post#7


UA Admin
Posts: 31,197
Joined: 20-June 02
From: Newcastle, WA


Is this problem isolated to that one conference room?

--------------------
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Brepea
post Sep 19 2017, 09:39 AM
Post#8



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


No, as I have tried this at a normal workstation with an ethernet cable...

Is there a place/person i can test the application with/in - so to rule out any potential issue with my application maybe (could there be an issue with my design if it works super fast on local pc?)...
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RAZMaddaz
post Sep 19 2017, 11:59 AM
Post#9


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Posts: 9,522
Joined: 23-May 05
From: Bethesda, MD USA


Brepea,

I see you are using Access 2010, what version of Access is on the Server and on their computer's?

RAZMaddaz
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AlbertKallal
post Sep 19 2017, 12:17 PM
Post#10


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Posts: 2,551
Joined: 12-April 07
From: Edmonton, Alberta Canada


As noted, I would check the persistent connection issue - that is #1 to double check.

The fact that you state it runs well with one user on that network is a "big" hint as to this being a persistent connection issue. If the system was slow always with one user, then it likey just speed of the network, or even some virus protection software that is scanning accDB files (so check the virus software - make sure it ignores access files).

Since you note that with 1 user it runs ok - then obviously it "can" run ok. Such a huge slowdown with additional users thus would not be network speed or issues - but that of Access flipping into mutli-user file mode - that is a slow process usually fixed by a persistent connection.

Regards,
Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP, 2003-2017)
Edmonton, Alberta Canada
kallal@msn.com
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DanielPineault
post Sep 19 2017, 12:28 PM
Post#11


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Posts: 5,451
Joined: 30-June 11



As a test, try opening, working with various files on the network (large excel or word files, outlook psts), how do they respond? If the network is slow with such files, then there is an excellent chance your database will be slow.

--------------------
Daniel Pineault (2010-2017 Microsoft MVP)
Professional Help: http://www.cardaconsultants.com
Free MS Access Code, Tips, Tricks and Samples: http://www.devhut.net

* Design should never say "Look at me". It should always say "Look at this". -- David Craib
* A user interface is like a joke, if you have to explain it, it's not that good! -- Martin LeBlanc


All code samples, demonstration databases, links,... are provided 'AS IS' and are to be used at your own risk! Take the necessary steps to check, validate ...
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Brepea
post Sep 19 2017, 12:39 PM
Post#12



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


Hi - thanks for the time in responding everyone...I so appreciate it as i'm really stuck here.

I've tried and tried and tried - and with 1 user it is ok. The minute someone else tries to open the application there is a huge issue with speed and nothing really works - well it does - but to load for e.g. a list box which only returns 80 records takes about 3-4 minutes.

Daniel - trying to open other file within the same folder - so - .pptx files with 10 odd pages in with images is quick.

I've been going through my code line by line and can't work out any anomalies...

RAZ: Everyone is using Access 2010...although there is a rollout of O365 in the pipeline (i think a have a handful of users who would eventually access this 2010 from 2016). I currently use AutoFEUpdater (by Tony Toews) to distribute it to all users.

Albert: What do you mean by persistent connection and how do I check /enable it?

Thanks again
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DanielPineault
post Sep 19 2017, 01:40 PM
Post#13


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 5,451
Joined: 30-June 11



QUOTE
What do you mean by persistent connection and how do I check /enable it?

see: http://www.devhut.net/2012/09/29/ms-access...split-database/

--------------------
Daniel Pineault (2010-2017 Microsoft MVP)
Professional Help: http://www.cardaconsultants.com
Free MS Access Code, Tips, Tricks and Samples: http://www.devhut.net

* Design should never say "Look at me". It should always say "Look at this". -- David Craib
* A user interface is like a joke, if you have to explain it, it's not that good! -- Martin LeBlanc


All code samples, demonstration databases, links,... are provided 'AS IS' and are to be used at your own risk! Take the necessary steps to check, validate ...
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Brepea
post Sep 19 2017, 02:09 PM
Post#14



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


In that I am not sure it is persistent connection issue, because I have a main form which opens and it's record source is a query. Does this discount the possibility of persistent connection issue?
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AlbertKallal
post Sep 19 2017, 02:29 PM
Post#15


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Posts: 2,551
Joined: 12-April 07
From: Edmonton, Alberta Canada


If you main form is “bound” to a back end table (even with a query), and that form remains open at all time, then that certainly would be a persistent connection.

As such, this setup sounds ok. I would also check for forms or reports having a NON default printer. If the user(s) in question don’t have any local printer (especially a default one), then this can also case a slowdown.

However, if “any” of the workstations work well with ONLY one user in the application, then we are again right back to the persistent connection issue.

If that main form is bound to a back end table (or query based on a back end table), and this form remains open for the Access session, then you do have a persistent connection.

Regards,
Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP)
Edmonton, Alberta Canada
kallal@msn.com
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Brepea
post Sep 19 2017, 03:52 PM
Post#16



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


What if you change the record source of the main form on load? For example...form is bound to query 1, if certain conditions aren't met I change the record source to query 2. Does this still constitute a persistent connection?
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RAZMaddaz
post Sep 19 2017, 05:48 PM
Post#17


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 9,522
Joined: 23-May 05
From: Bethesda, MD USA


Brepea,

I know Daniel asked this before, in post 2, but I'm not sure I see the answer.

Therefore, after you just said how you are changing the main form, based on a query, I just wanted to know if these Forms are on each User's computer.

Thanks.

RAZMaddaz
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Brepea
post Sep 20 2017, 12:39 AM
Post#18



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


Yes, on C:\Databases\Application\.accde and the AutoFEUpdater forces /runtime ....mmmh I just assume they have runtime if they have full Access...could this be an issue (obviously I can and will try, but good to hear here before trying).

I was also thinking of stripping out all tables, forms, queries,etc.and only have my main form in a copy of it and trying that in network environment to rule out an issue with my form.
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AlbertKallal
post Sep 20 2017, 01:33 AM
Post#19


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Posts: 2,551
Joined: 12-April 07
From: Edmonton, Alberta Canada


QUOTE
I change the record source to query 2. Does this still constitute a persistent connection?


That is a good question. My answer would be not likely. A change in the data for a form likely would cause the connection to be re-issued.

I would during testing simply launch some linked table, minimize it, and NOW try the application.

You want that connection established - and not changed or touched during the running of the application.

The above may not necessary fix your issue - but I would test + eliminate this as a possible issue.

Albert D. Kallal (Access MVP, 2003-2017)
Edmonton, Alberta Canada
kallal@msn.com
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Brepea
post Sep 20 2017, 01:58 AM
Post#20



Posts: 515
Joined: 11-January 09
From: UK


So is the /runtime a non-issue? i.e. if the users have full A2010 - they should be fine right (if i force the /runtime)?
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