UtterAccess.com
X   Site Message
(Message will auto close in 2 seconds)

Welcome to UtterAccess! Please ( Login   or   Register )

Custom Search
2 Pages V  1 2 >  (Go to first unread post)
   Reply to this topicStart new topic
> Version For Database Development?, Access 2016    
 
   
appro
post Sep 10 2019, 04:06 PM
Post#1



Posts: 199
Joined: 23-January 05



I'm running A2016 on my development machine. I have a new laptop arriving soon and am thinking of installing Office 365 on that. I don't do much development on that machine.....only very occasionally.

Are there any/many downsides to going down the Office 365 path?
Go to the top of the page
 
theDBguy
post Sep 10 2019, 04:12 PM
Post#2


Access Wiki and Forums Moderator
Posts: 76,605
Joined: 19-June 07
From: SunnySandyEggo


Hi. Please don't take my word for it, but I can't think of any. Good luck!

--------------------
Just my 2 cents... "And if I claim to be a wise man, it surely means that I don't know" - Kansas
Access Website | Access Blog | Email
Go to the top of the page
 
GroverParkGeorge
post Sep 10 2019, 04:32 PM
Post#3


UA Admin
Posts: 36,084
Joined: 20-June 02
From: Newcastle, WA


The MAIN difference is how licensing is handled: perpetual vs. annual subscription.

Also, newer features will be introduced first in the O365 version and later, if at all, in the "boxed" version.

Otherwise, nothing that I am aware of either.

--------------------
My Real Name Is George. Grover Park Consulting is where I do business.
How to Ask a Good Question
Beginning SQL Server
Go to the top of the page
 
isladogs
post Sep 10 2019, 04:38 PM
Post#4


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 1,834
Joined: 4-June 18
From: Somerset, UK


If you are developing for clients, you should always use the 'lowest common denominator' for your Access development.
So I still develop mainly in A2010 because many of my clients use that but none are using A2007 or earlier.

One advantage is getting the latest features ..but that only matters if you will make use of them.
In some cases, those updates won't work in earlier versions e.g. Modern charts, support for bigint datatype.
Disadvantages include monthly updates and frequent complaints about the poor quality of testing before updates are released.

Also the default installation is now 64-bit but it offers minimal improvements over 32-bit and any API declaration will need updating.

--------------------
Colin (Mendip Data Systems)
Website, email
Go to the top of the page
 
appro
post Sep 10 2019, 04:45 PM
Post#5



Posts: 199
Joined: 23-January 05



Thanks for your input and advice gents. I used to develop in 2010 until recently moving to A2016. I spoke with all clients first and all but one is using either A2016 or 365 and one is updating from 2010 shortly. I have a VM with 2010 on it for if and when that client needs changes or additions.

My main concern about going to 365 is updates. As we all know, sometimes they do far more harm than good thanks to the very ordinary QC that seems to be the norm at MS these days. I'm assuming, and can someone please clarify this, that 365 updates can be put on hold, same as Windows updates.

Also, from what I understand the version of Access currently in 365 is A2016. Is that actually the case and when will it likely change to 2019? Does MS give prior warning of that when it happens?
Go to the top of the page
 
GroverParkGeorge
post Sep 10 2019, 04:52 PM
Post#6


UA Admin
Posts: 36,084
Joined: 20-June 02
From: Newcastle, WA


Actually, I believe you won't see any further version changes like that. It's "O365" from now on.

Some might say that WE are now Microsoft's QA team.

--------------------
My Real Name Is George. Grover Park Consulting is where I do business.
How to Ask a Good Question
Beginning SQL Server
Go to the top of the page
 
appro
post Sep 10 2019, 04:55 PM
Post#7



Posts: 199
Joined: 23-January 05



smile.gif I'm not sure if I should thank you for that or not George.
Go to the top of the page
 
GroverParkGeorge
post Sep 10 2019, 04:56 PM
Post#8


UA Admin
Posts: 36,084
Joined: 20-June 02
From: Newcastle, WA


It's a big job, but "somebody" has to do it.

--------------------
My Real Name Is George. Grover Park Consulting is where I do business.
How to Ask a Good Question
Beginning SQL Server
Go to the top of the page
 
dale.fye
post Sep 10 2019, 05:08 PM
Post#9



Posts: 161
Joined: 28-March 18
From: Virginia


@isladogs,

"but none are using A2007 or earlier."

Wish I could say that, I've still got a number of clients that are using 2003, despite my recommendation to upgrade. It becomes a real pain in the a55!

Dale

--------------------
Dale Fye
Microsoft Access MVP 2013-2016
Developing Solutions, LLC
Go to the top of the page
 
projecttoday
post Sep 10 2019, 05:34 PM
Post#10


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 11,208
Joined: 10-February 04
From: South Charleston, WV


I've never used it so correct me if I'm wrong but don't you have to pay a monthly for Office 365 as opposed to a one-time purchase price?

--------------------
Robert Crouser
Go to the top of the page
 
DanielPineault
post Sep 10 2019, 05:48 PM
Post#11


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 6,978
Joined: 30-June 11



QUOTE
don't you have to pay a monthly for Office 365 as opposed to a one-time purchase price?

Exactly. Access 2019 one time purchase, Office 365 is subscription (pay monthly or annually).

Access 2019 - is a static product. You get security and bug updates, that's it.
Office 365 - is a dynamic product. You get security, bug updates and feature updates. So you'll get anything that Microsoft develops and releases. This is good and bad. You get new features which can be fun, but you also are continually getting buggy updates that cause continuous problems and headaches. Windows 10 and Office 365 are both following the same update process and both are horribly buggy!

The other thin that I dislike is that these newer product require access to the internet on a regular basis (every 30 days I believe) to phone home otherwise they lock themselves down. So there is no way to set things up and then isolate them. So from a security perspective they are actually worse than previous version as you have to leave them connected.


QUOTE
Some might say that WE are now Microsoft's QA team.

Might?! It's not a question of might, it IS what is the current reality. We have become guinea pigs for Microsoft. They pump out software without proper testing and wait for us to report problems and then react. It permits them to push out update faster, but ruins the user experience. I just found this post which says it exactly as it at MS and how they fired the entire QA team! https://mspoweruser.com/ex-microsoft-explai...10-development/

--------------------
Daniel Pineault (2010-2019 Microsoft MVP, UA VIP, EE Distinguished Expert 2018)
Professional Help: https://www.cardaconsultants.com
Free MS Access Code, Tips, Tricks and Samples: https://www.devhut.net

* Design should never say "Look at me". It should always say "Look at this". -- David Craib
* A user interface is like a joke, if you have to explain it, it's not that good! -- Martin LeBlanc


All code samples, demonstration databases, links,... are provided 'AS IS' and are to be used at your own risk! Take the necessary steps to check, validate ...(you are responsible for your choices and actions)
Go to the top of the page
 
RJD
post Sep 10 2019, 05:57 PM
Post#12


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 10,133
Joined: 25-October 10
From: Gulf South USA


Hi Robert: Actually it's an annual fee I think ( maybe monthly option?). A friend just got a new computer, and took the advice of a clerk at Office Depot to get 365. She had no clue that she had to install locally to get Access and Publisher or that there was an annual fee. Nor does she understand what 64 vs 32 even means. Or that version control is lost. MS and their sales channels have clearly left most of their users in the dark. And the QA thing George mentioned is a real problem as well.

Brave new world now.

Joe

--------------------
"Each problem that I solved became a rule, which served afterwards to solve other problems."
"You just keep pushing. You just keep pushing. I made every mistake that could be made. But I just kept pushing."

Rene Descartes 1596-1650 (Mathematician and Philosopher)
Go to the top of the page
 
WildBird
post Sep 10 2019, 07:41 PM
Post#13


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 3,640
Joined: 19-August 03
From: Auckland, Little Australia


I am a contractor, so I work at client sites, dont do any development work at home, so I use what the client has. Cuts out a lot of issues with references, and so many versioning issues.

People ask what about support when I finish? I only provide support up till contract finishes. A couple of recent projects I suggested, quite strongly, that they put the source files I used, onto a USB drive, and fire it into the sun!. Not that my code was bad, but the way they setup a project was terrible, and I had to build around it. Suggested new architecture to do it properly, but not sure what they ended up doing - was Govt job and had elections coming up and so no one was sure of what was happening. Current job is a migration, a one off, and the same. Anyway, I digress.

Agree with using lowest denominator if possible, otherwise get virtual machines and try to replicate client sites so easier to support.

Not a fan of any subscription service. I often am without decent internet, and dont like idea of needing internet to do stuff. Prefer static programs.


--------------------
Beer, natures brain defragging tool.
Go to the top of the page
 
tina t
post Sep 10 2019, 07:42 PM
Post#14



Posts: 6,157
Joined: 11-November 10
From: SoCal, USA


well, it's a brilliant marketing strategy on Microsoft's part - the result is that they've been able to convince many of their customers to do their beta testing for them, and pay Microsoft for that dubious privilege! :( tina

--------------------
"the wheel never stops turning"
Go to the top of the page
 
DanielPineault
post Sep 10 2019, 08:31 PM
Post#15


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 6,978
Joined: 30-June 11



And we have a winner!

Tina's right on the $$$, you pay for the subscription service, do Microsoft QA for free, and give all your data to MS for them to do as they please as part of the EULA you agree to when you install the software (but no one actually reads, little alone understands that stuff anyways). They are brilliant, no question there!

--------------------
Daniel Pineault (2010-2019 Microsoft MVP, UA VIP, EE Distinguished Expert 2018)
Professional Help: https://www.cardaconsultants.com
Free MS Access Code, Tips, Tricks and Samples: https://www.devhut.net

* Design should never say "Look at me". It should always say "Look at this". -- David Craib
* A user interface is like a joke, if you have to explain it, it's not that good! -- Martin LeBlanc


All code samples, demonstration databases, links,... are provided 'AS IS' and are to be used at your own risk! Take the necessary steps to check, validate ...(you are responsible for your choices and actions)
Go to the top of the page
 
pere_de_chipstic...
post Sep 11 2019, 08:35 AM
Post#16


UtterAccess Editor
Posts: 10,512
Joined: 8-November 07
From: South coast, England


Just to add a my 2cents.gif

I would not risk allowing MS to update my development copy of Access - I'd soon lose all my clients if the updates no longer worked on their PCs using an older Access version. I remain with the earliest version of Access that my clients use, until MS no longer support it, or I need a specific new feature, when I can upgrade to the latest version in a planned and controlled manner.

The other advantage is that this is significantly cheaper than paying out a monthly subscription, when only a very few of the new features are ever of any benefit to my clients.

hth

--------------------
Warm regards
Bernie
Go to the top of the page
 
DanielPineault
post Sep 11 2019, 08:39 AM
Post#17


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 6,978
Joined: 30-June 11



Sadly, now, they are forcing updates and you can't really stop the process, defer maybe, but not really stop it.

MS is making things very difficult to manage.

--------------------
Daniel Pineault (2010-2019 Microsoft MVP, UA VIP, EE Distinguished Expert 2018)
Professional Help: https://www.cardaconsultants.com
Free MS Access Code, Tips, Tricks and Samples: https://www.devhut.net

* Design should never say "Look at me". It should always say "Look at this". -- David Craib
* A user interface is like a joke, if you have to explain it, it's not that good! -- Martin LeBlanc


All code samples, demonstration databases, links,... are provided 'AS IS' and are to be used at your own risk! Take the necessary steps to check, validate ...(you are responsible for your choices and actions)
Go to the top of the page
 
tina t
post Sep 11 2019, 05:44 PM
Post#18



Posts: 6,157
Joined: 11-November 10
From: SoCal, USA


OMG, MS is becoming HAL! ;)
This post has been edited by tina t: Sep 11 2019, 05:45 PM

--------------------
"the wheel never stops turning"
Go to the top of the page
 
appro
post Sep 11 2019, 08:17 PM
Post#19



Posts: 199
Joined: 23-January 05



Office 365 has an option to disable updates. Does this do what it says and does it keep updates disabled until they are enabled again by the user?
This post has been edited by appro: Sep 11 2019, 08:17 PM
Go to the top of the page
 
isladogs
post Sep 12 2019, 03:01 AM
Post#20


UtterAccess VIP
Posts: 1,834
Joined: 4-June 18
From: Somerset, UK


I may be wrong here but I believe that the ability to disable Office 365 updates through the account options is a fairly recent change.
You've always been able to prevent individual updates running ...though of course they keep coming back...

However, according to the info provided, you can now switch off Office 365 updates completely.

Whereas with Windows 10, you can defer for a limited time depending on whether its a feature update or security update (100 or 35 days IIRC) but cannot stop updates completely

--------------------
Colin (Mendip Data Systems)
Website, email
Go to the top of the page
 
2 Pages V  1 2 >


Custom Search


RSSSearch   Top   Lo-Fi    21st November 2019 - 12:05 PM